Islam or Christianity

[RageAndLov]

I think both Christianity and Islam are shitty, and I wish for their abolishment. I can understand many USAmericans attacking Christianity more than Islam because the first is in their every-day life. I experience Christianity and Islam as things from far-away countries, so I luckily don't have to deal with them daily. I therefore see upon the religions as equally bad, instead of having to attack one more than the other because the ones around my are followers of one of the religions.

[Llamas]

I think both Christianity and Islam are shitty, and I wish for their abolishment. I can understand many USAmericans attacking Christianity more than Islam because the first is in their every-day life. I experience Christianity and Islam as things from far-away countries, so I luckily don't have to deal with them daily. I therefore see upon the religions as equally bad, instead of having to attack one more than the other because the ones around my are followers of one of the religions.

Wait, what? Aren't like 70% of Norwegians Protestants?

And Americans aren't the only ones who deal with Christianity every day; I deal with Catholicism all the time in Slovenia, and I did as well in Austria when I was living there.

32% of Norwegian citizens responded that "they believe there is a God"
47% answered that "they believe there is some sort of spirit or life force".
17% answered that "they do not believe there is any sort of spirit, God, or life force".
4% answered that they "do not know".

Sure, the 21% of Norwegians who are agnostic/atheist is higher than in the US (where it's 16%), but it's a huge jump to say that religion is something from "far-away countries".

[RageAndLov]

Wait, what? Aren't like 70% of Norwegians Protestants?

And Americans aren't the only ones who deal with Christianity every day; I deal with Catholicism all the time in Slovenia, and I did as well in Austria when I was living there.

32% of Norwegian citizens responded that "they believe there is a God"
47% answered that "they believe there is some sort of spirit or life force".
17% answered that "they do not believe there is any sort of spirit, God, or life force".
4% answered that they "do not know".

Sure, the 21% of Norwegians who are agnostic/atheist is higher than in the US (where it's 16%), but it's a huge jump to say that religion is something from "far-away countries".

See, the thing about Norway which is incredibly stupid is that there is an official state church, and everyone born in Norway will automatically be registered in church. Therefore, the official number of Christians in Norway is 70%. That includes me as well, and I am as atheist as they come. You can write a letter to the church where you say you want to unregistered, but few bothers with this, because being registered in the church doesn't impact your daily life. My girlfriend has sent said letter and is now official without a religion, and I am going to so soonly.
The affair of a state church is highly controversial here, and both non-Protestants and the clergy want to abolish the state church, as the non-Protestants don't want to be associated with that church, and the priests feel they have to be too moderate in order to obey the governmental decisions.
As far as faith goes, the polls differ, but you will mainly see about 70% stating they do not believe in God. I wonder where you have got your numbers from. Norway is one of the most atheistic countries in the world, and I think when the country refrains from having an official religion, that number will go up.

[Llamas]

See, the thing about Norway which is incredibly stupid is that there is an official state church, and everyone born in Norway will automatically be registered in church. Therefore, the official number of Christians in Norway is 70%. That includes me as well, and I am as atheist as they come. You can write a letter to the church where you say you want to unregistered, but few bothers with this, because being registered in the church doesn't impact your daily life. My girlfriend has sent said letter and is now official without a religion, and I am going to so soonly.
The affair of a state church is highly controversial here, and both non-Protestants and the clergy want to abolish the state church, as the non-Protestants don't want to be associated with that church, and the priests feel they have to be too moderate in order to obey the governmental decisions.
As far as faith goes, the polls differ, but you will mainly see about 70% stating they do not believe in God. I wonder where you have got your numbers from. Norway is one of the most atheistic countries in the world, and I think when the country refrains from having an official religion, that number will go up.

I see your point in that there is a high number of Norwegians who are registered with the church but aren't actually religious (there are plenty of American "Catholics" who do the same thing). I'll concede that maybe those poll numbers I found weren't accurate. However, religion is not "far away" from your country. You just recently had a crazy Christian nutcase shoot up a bunch of teenagers.

Just found this:
"Christianity is the largest religion in Norway. Norway has historically been called a Christian country, but according to the most recent Eurobarometer Poll 2005,[1] only 32% of the Norwegian population say they believe there is a God." Yep, it's a lot lower than the 70% who are registered with the church, but 32% is still pretty substantial - and definitely puts Christianity well within your country. I lived in one of the world's most atheist countries myself (Czech), and definitely could NOT have said Christianity was something from "far-away" lands. It's about as silly as Ahmadinejad saying homosexuality wasn't a problem in his country because Iran is a straight country.

[RageAndLov]

I see your point in that there is a high number of Norwegians who are registered with the church but aren't actually religious (there are plenty of American "Catholics" who do the same thing). I'll concede that maybe those poll numbers I found weren't accurate. However, religion is not "far away" from your country. You just recently had a crazy Christian nutcase shoot up a bunch of teenagers.

Just found this:
"Christianity is the largest religion in Norway. Norway has historically been called a Christian country, but according to the most recent Eurobarometer Poll 2005,[1] only 32% of the Norwegian population say they believe there is a God." Yep, it's a lot lower than the 70% who are registered with the church, but 32% is still pretty substantial - and definitely puts Christianity well within your country. I lived in one of the world's most atheist countries myself (Czech), and definitely could NOT have said Christianity was something from "far-away" lands. It's about as silly as Ahmadinejad saying homosexuality wasn't a problem in his country because Iran is a straight country.

Christianity is absolutely a part of our country, but it is a minority, and most of the minority is very moderate. I know a few people who I have known for years, which under some discussion have mentioned that they believe in a deity, and I have been nearly shocked because nothing in their behaviour would imply any spirituality; they drink heavily, have sex before marriage, never go to church, have not even read the Bible cover to cover.
It is mostly the older generation who are devoutly religious, and when they pass away, I think we will see the Christian minority shrink even more. Many people don't care to say they are Christian because it's looked down upon by some parts of society, like the ones I told about earlier.
I don't daily deal with religion because the majority here isn't religious, and because the few who are won't necessarily express their religious views. The type of religion you will find in the US or Iran are not the same of the religion you will find here.

[Llamas]

Christianity is absolutely a part of our country, but it is a minority, and most of the minority is very moderate. I know a few people who I have known for years, which under some discussion have mentioned that they believe in a deity, and I have been nearly shocked because nothing in their behaviour would imply any spirituality; they drink heavily, have sex before marriage, never go to church, have not even read the Bible cover to cover.

That's pretty much true of 99% of the people I know in the US who are supposedly Christian (though the majority of my American friends are agnostic or atheist).

It is mostly the older generation who are devoutly religious, and when they pass away, I think we will see the Christian minority shrink even more.

Also true in the US.

Many people don't care to say they are Christian because it's looked down upon by some parts of society, like the ones I told about earlier.

That I find kinda sad :-/ I don't think any religion or lack thereof should be looked down on just simply because you believe in it.

I don't daily deal with religion because the majority here isn't religious, and because the few who are won't necessarily express their religious views. The type of religion you will find in the US or Iran are not the same of the religion you will find here.

Can I just clarify here - because I have to give you the benefit of the doubt - that you didn't actually mean that religion in Iran and the US are comparable? Please tell me you didn't mean that...

And okay, if you'd said that... that you don't deal daily with religion because there are fewer religious people there and the ones you know don't openly express their views... that makes sense. Maybe you should work a bit on wording

[T-6005]

I think there's an extremely strong case to argue that religion in Tehran and religion in Phoenix are extremely similar, in social intent if not in scope. Particularly in Lower Tehran.

[XYlophonetreeZ]

I'm not going to talk about my personal interpretation of the Bible or Quran here, because it doesn't matter. Culturally, there are plenty of Christians and Muslims with ideologies that tolerant and peaceful, and with ideologies that are intolerant and hurtful.

So, I'm not going to defend Islam per se, but I just wanted to rant that the term "Moderate Muslim," particularly the way it was used post-9/11, is one of the most bullshit subtle propaganda terms ever. Use this term, and I'll likely wish death upon you. People kept saying we need to "reach out" to moderate Muslims, with "moderate Muslim" roughly meaning "Muslims who don't want to kill all nonbelievers." Did you catch the subtle implication that violence is inherent to Islam, and therefore needs to be "moderated"? Yep.

[mario_spaghettio]

violence is inherent to Islam

truth spoken

[Llamas]

Sorry to bump a fairly old thread, but I just came across something that is very relevant and sheds new light on this topic.

40 Examples of Christian Privelege

I found this very interesting, as the fact that Christianity is very much the religion of privilege (well, Scientology beats it) is something I hadn't considered. Throughout the entire world, there are no well-off Muslim nations... and Muslims receive little to no privilege throughout successful society.