Duty?

[sKratch]

I was talking to my girlfriend and we've always joked about moving to Canada or something if the situation gets bad here, but I realized that I would rather stay and do whatever I could to make things better. She said she associates herself more with her parents' background (British) even though she was born and raised in the United States and therefore feels no responsibility to put effort into improving a bad situation in the US. Personally, I think it's my duty as an American to stick it out and voice my opinion while doing everything I can to make things better. What do you think? Do you feel no guilt in saying "shit sucks, oh well I'm outta here"? I think that regardless of how futile my efforts might be, I have a responsibility to protest and make myself heard rather than running off on my country, so to speak. Obviously, I didn't chose to be born here. Both of my parents are from Poland and moved here in the late 70's or early 80's, so I very well could have ended up living in Poland had they not moved. Regardless, I grew up here and benefited from the American life. Therefore I feel I have a duty to fix what I see as wrong. I don't know, maybe I'm optimistic and naive, but I just think that moving to Canada and leaving America's problems behind is a step in the wrong direction.

[BREAK]

Fine then, stay here. Enjoy getting drafted & further terrorist attacks on American soil.

[sKratch]

Meh, I doubt there'll be a draft. Won't go if there is.

[Lars]

I love the perks if you don't keep the selective service records up to date.

[Betty]

"Regardless, I grew up here and benefited from the American life"

In a way you have a point... but in a way I have mixed feelings. Like, America is the way it is today because of all of the past leaders. And if you totally want to revamp the country, then it wouldn't be the same and those benefits you speak of wouldn't be the same either. So I guess I think that if you want to change a few things about the country, then yes, you should stick it out and work at it. But if you hate everything about the US and want to change everything, then maybe you should move because you don't belong there. Make sense?

[sKratch]

Yeah you do have a point I suppose. I guess if things went totally to shit I'd leave eventually.

[SicN Twisted]

The reasons you mention are the reasons I haven't left this country already. I feel that there are so few real progressives in this country, the ones who are have a duty to stay and have as much of an effect as they possibly can. In responce to you, Betty, I do think that complete revolutionary change would make us lose the standard of living we have. Canada is a much better society and has much less poverty then the United States. So is Holland, Switzerland, and several other countries, and they're not all about corperate welfare and international terrorism, which I'd have to say are the two beacons that make my country stick out.

[sKratch]

Looks like we pretty much agree, sic. I see a problem, however, and it's that many changes--such as real health care and social service reforms--are unlikely to occur. I'm not trying to sound like a revolutionist or something, but some changes are only plausible of they occur drastically. However, with such a close election, if the voter turnout represents the country's alignment as a whole, there is obviously widespread support for Bush's policies. In other words, there are too many people who disagree with a movement toward the welfare state and other quasi-socialist reforms, as well as ending our foreign police dutes etc. I guess Bush just has to completely fuck everything up first, although I am sure there are people who will stand behind him no matter what.

[wheelchairman]

Personally I do believe that if you tried to reform the US into a socialist-like economy, you would completely destroy the economy. That's why it would take revolutionary change.

Betty- The people in the US who are completely against what the US stands for, they are not just some flukes you know, they are a product of their environment. If this number were to grow because the environment these people live in, grows, then you would be creating the foundation for a large revolutionary movement. However, quite on the other hand, if a government were able to satisfy the needs of the people well enough, this would not be a problem. It's just, comments like these annoy me, despite the fact that I don't live in the US currently, because this is the second time you've suggested people to leave the country. But I would on the other hand, tell these people to get much more active into whatever political party they support.

[sKratch]

Personally I do believe that if you tried to reform the US into a socialist-like economy, you would completely destroy the economy. That's why it would take revolutionary change.

Right, I was going to mention that about the economy probably falling apart otherwise but I got caught up in digressions. I'm not saying I'm necessarily for a revolution, but it's just an observation that it's probably the only way a radical change like that could occur. Talk to me after a few more conservative presidents and maybe I'll have a different mindset.